Life:Understood - Lerato Khoza

*Warning: This episode does contain references to sexual assault and self-harm. Listener discretion is advised.*

Lerato Khoza (formerly Mathews) was raised in a violent home, being the youngest of 13 children. A very blended family, spread over decades, created an environment for this quiet girl to be a bit overlooked. She chose to fight her battles on her own by whatever means necessary. This resulted in a broken, hurting person just looking to be understood by others. It wasn't until a chance encounter on a regular day, that Lerato found the beginning of her brand new story. Finally, things started to make sense.

Don't underestimate the power of a transformed life.

notthesame.cfm@gmail.com

Transcript

SPEAKER_01 0:08

And the last one I have taken off. My dad was a tax. In our area, all of it was scale was. Financially, it just went bad. We lost almost everything. There was always violence in my fault. To me, it was normal.

SPEAKER_00 0:46

You're listening to Not the Same, a podcast that brings you true stories of real people sharing their personal testimonies of transformation. I am your host, Rachel Heinrich. Let's go ahead and get right into it today. I have with me a very special young lady from our congregation here in El Dorado Park. She came in roughly two to three years ago, and over the last few years, I have gotten to know her quite well. I'm excited for her to tell her story. I want to introduce you to Lorato Matthews. So thank you.

SPEAKER_01 1:16

Thank you for having me. Like it's such an honor. Because I listened to like each and every one of them, literally. I'm excited.

SPEAKER_00 1:23

Just go ahead and start with how you grew up and then we'll go from there.

SPEAKER_01 1:27

Okay, so I'm not originally from here. I'm from Northwest. Right? Northwest is like a province from Rastenberg, right? The city. That's where I was born and raised. I had to move this side at Five K Spec when I started high school. That's when I moved this.

SPEAKER_00 1:42

Okay. So growing up there, tell me what your home life, your parents, how many siblings, your family life.

SPEAKER_01 1:49

I have a lot of siblings, hey. Like I have 13 siblings. Oh wow. Yes. So my dad was a taxi owner. So I don't know if you know this stereotype about like taxi owners having like a lot of wives that. I've never heard that. So please talk about it. I want to hear. So my dad was a taxi owner, so he's like a womanizer in a way. Okay. So he had his first wife, and then they had a child, and then they got divorced, and then he remarried again. Um, had children with that woman, and obviously the reason why he kept on getting so divorced so many times was because he had a lot of women. So he also got divorced there, and then he later on married my mom. But in the process of him marrying my mom, he was getting a divorce, and my mom didn't know. Oh no. So the other woman found out about my mom, but my mom didn't know anything. So she thinks she's woman number one, but she's really the side piece.

SPEAKER_00 2:42

Yes. Oh. Yes.

SPEAKER_01 2:44

So my dad has like a lot of property, like a lot of houses. Okay. So it was easy for him to get away with it because let's say El Dorado Park, my mom will be in El Dorado Park, and then the other wife will be in Rivelee. So that's far.

SPEAKER_00 2:56

One knows anything. For sure. He can keep these women in different houses. Yes. Oh, yes. So your mom was the third wife. Yes. The second wife divorced him as well. And then he married my mom.

SPEAKER_01 3:08

Okay.

SPEAKER_00 3:08

And then how many children just your mom?

SPEAKER_01 3:10

Okay, so my mom has five kids.

SPEAKER_00 3:13

Oh, okay.

SPEAKER_01 3:14

Yes. And then my dad has 11 kids. So my mom got into a marriage with three kids. She only has two kids with my dad. It's you and then one other sibling? Yes.

SPEAKER_00 3:25

Is that your brother?

SPEAKER_01 3:26

Yes. So we didn't really grow up with my other siblings, my dad's had siblings, because in as much as my dad was divorced, he still kept contact with the other wife. So I guess he was supporting them separately. So he basically had separate household.

SPEAKER_00 3:40

So he he did take care of his other children. Yes.

SPEAKER_01 3:43

Okay. They were older. So my parents are very old. My dad is 72 years old. And then my mom is 59. 59. Yes. How old was she when she had you? I don't know. I think she was wait, you're how old? 19? Yes, I'm 19. She's 59. She's turning 60 this year. Yeah, so she would have been 40, 41. Also because they got married when my mom was already old and my dad was also old. So I was out of the blue.

SPEAKER_00 4:09

So they were 40 and 50. Yes. Roughly. Yes. When you were born.

SPEAKER_01 4:14

That's crazy. I'm only thinking about it now.

SPEAKER_00 4:16

Yeah. Especially here. It's not like a super common thing. Yeah. I mean, it's more common nowadays. And then your mom still had a brother before you or after you? I'm the last born from both sides. Okay.

SPEAKER_01 4:27

So they had my brother and then me after. And they were already married when you were born? Yes, they were already married. So with my mom, I'm not really quite sure, but I do know that this was a second marriage. But the first one, it was a traditional marriage. Okay, not in the courts, but yes, so she didn't really have to struggle with getting divorced. My mom had a child when she was young. Like I think when she was 16. Okay. And then the father went to prison. So she met another guy. They got married traditionally. She had two kids with that guy. There was a lot of witchcraft going on in the household. Because there was a lot of witchcraft going on, my mom was a spiritual person. She was called to be a sangwama, but she was not really entertaining it because my mom was a very religious person. Like she didn't believe in ancestors. Oh, wow. But obviously, because she was getting sick a lot and there was a lot of witchcraft from the guys' side of the family, she was always told that, oh, you need to become a sangama, da da da da da. So now there was a night when my mom found herbs in the house that she was not supposed to find. And then her mother-in-law got sick the following morning, and then they chased her out of the house. Literally, they paid Hitman to come kill her. Your mom? Yes. And she was very young. I think she was 21 years around that time. So those people came in and said, You need to run. We can't kill you because you are so young, we're even gonna start, but you need to run away. So she ran away. That's how she met my dad. She went from here to Northwest. That's when she met my dad.

SPEAKER_00 5:52

Oh, okay. So she was from Johannesburg and then she went away because of the situation. Yes. And then she met your father? Yes. Okay, so then how old is your brother? He's 26. 26. So then they were together for a long time before they even had him. Yes. Okay. Maybe like five years. She had three children with her that she brought.

SPEAKER_01 6:12

They were very, very, very small, like three years, four years. Yeah. So there's a year age gap between my brother and my sister. Mm-hmm. We always known my father's dear father. For sure. My dad loves kissing.

SPEAKER_00 6:24

Yeah. That says a lot though, because it's not very common. Normally they want the women with no children. So that's saying a lot that your dad at least wanted to be there and support them. So then how old was your oldest siblings in the house, like when you were being raised? Mm-hmm.

SPEAKER_01 6:41

I think my brother was the one that I always felt I could relate to. Because he's closer. When I was eight, he was 15, 16. Okay. So at least they're still like childish. I can like play around with them. But my other siblings they were already working, like past 20, I think. All of them. Okay, that makes sense. I didn't really have a relationship with them. Also, they were not staying at home. So I was raised with only two siblings, but I had a lot of siblings. Yeah. So I was raised with my sister that comes before my brother. Okay. But she was already, oh, she was like 21, you know. Yeah. I think this year she's 20, 34. Wow.

SPEAKER_00 7:15

So then when you were young, obviously, this is all stuff that you've learned later, right? But then growing up in that situation, did you guys live in a city or was it a rural area? It was the same as like a Logato Park, Freedom Park. Okay. Yeah. Okay. What was your home life? Like, was your dad involved? Did your mom work? Like what was your home life like growing up?

SPEAKER_01 7:36

Okay, so like I said, my dad was a taxi owner. And also he had like cows, stuff like that. I don't know what they call those things. Like a plaza, plaza or something like that. I don't know.

SPEAKER_00 7:45

I don't know the word here. Yeah. We would just say a farmer or a rancher or something.

SPEAKER_01 7:49

Yes, basically he owned that. Yes. Okay. And so I would say my dad pretty much had like money. Okay. Um I guess that's why he also it was easy for women to just be attracted to him. So when we were growing up, we had everything, honestly. I never ever went to bed hungry. But my dad was a very, very violent person. My dad was always quiet. I think I've only started hearing my dad speak more when he's older now. But before, my dad was a very violent person, owned a gun. So in our area, a lot of people were scared of us. Okay. They were very, very scared of us. That was like my life home. And then there was a period in our life where my dad was drinking a lot. So he was overspending money, and we ended up selling some stuff. Then, yeah, financially, it just went bad. Oh wow. How old were you? Um, I was six, seven, eight. Okay. I don't know. I was always like a pretty mature kid, if I can put it in that way. Because I've always noticed things. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 8:49

No, I can see that even now. Because I know when you just had your birthday and you were 19, and I think a lot of people were like, she's only 19. We feel like you're more grunk because of life, right?

SPEAKER_01 8:59

So yes, these are the things that my mom didn't have to tell me. Like I grew up in a home where we never spoke about anything. So from pretty much a young age, then we lost almost everything. But my mom was always hands-on. She took over. My dad didn't work for such a long time. So I'd stayed home with my dad. Okay. Um, because my mom also had to go and do the Sangoma things. So she stepped in with the money for the Sangoma things, and as well, she got a better job.

SPEAKER_00 9:24

Let's talk about the religious side of growing up. You said your your mom was religious and spiritual, but she's caught in the middle of this. You said there's the Sangoma side, and then she felt like she was called, but then she kind of resisted. Yes. Judging by what you said, you can make money being a Sangoma, right? Because people are always paying you to do things. So do you think that's when she got into it? Was for the money side of it?

SPEAKER_01 9:52

And as well, my dad believes in ancestral things a lot. So he started influencing my mom into like drinking. And so there was a lot of influence from my dad's side. So a lot of decisions that my mom made was from my dad's influence. So also it was just a thing of like, oh, my husband believes in that. So I might as well just do it. And she was getting sick a lot. Sometimes her mom would wake up, her legs are not picking. Wow. So that's when they decided that you know what? You have to do this. So now I stayed home with my dad.

SPEAKER_00 10:22

While your mom was working.

SPEAKER_01 10:23

But I've always been a daddy's car because I was always left with my dad. So my mom worked, her job was pretty much demanding, like she never had time for us. But she's my mom, so we never really noticed that it was like, oh yeah, seems normal when you're young. Because also she would come with nice stuff. So it's like, oh mom, you know. So we we'd never really noticed that oh, she's not been here for like a week because she brings nice stuff, says, Oh, hi mom, you know.

SPEAKER_00 10:47

Yeah. Your dad did his drinking slow down once the money left, or it just always stayed? Um, okay. He wasn't really like a drunk kid, but he'll pretty much drink every weekend. Okay.

SPEAKER_01 10:58

So during the week, no. But the weekends would yes. And my mom also started doing that. They were not really like drunk kids until like later. So would you say it was pretty stable growing up? Honestly, to me it was normal. Like everything was just normal, but there was always violence in my home. Like we were just that weird family that we know at night it's about to go down. Wow. And it was normal to us. Like my dad would come back drunk. My mom is very close with her brother. Okay. So her brother would come in sometimes and visit, maybe to like look for work that side. And then all the time when he comes in, like he'd also take care of us because he's my uncle, you know. Okay. So this is your mom's brother, you said? Yes. Okay. So I think my dad and my uncle were not getting along. I don't know what was the story between them, but my dad would come drunk at 12 a.m. and then he'd start hitting my uncle, and then there's fights, there's violence. And people would just not even come out anymore because they're used to it. Yeah. I think when I was eight, it was like around December. So two houses away. There's this other woman. She she's my mom's best friend. So her kids were also like my best friend. So we grew up with them and they were hosting like a party or something. So we're all having fun, da da da. But I was always hanging around my parents. I was never with other kids. So I can see there's a bit of tension, like something is going on. My dad is giving my mom an eye. We all knew my dad is a violent person. He takes off like very easily, he has a temper. And then there was another guy, let's say, with my mom, you know. But my mom is a very friendly person, like she's touchy-tachy and friendly with everyone. Yeah. So she was busy being herself, and plus she's drunk. Yeah. So my dad is like, let's go. It's time to go now. So my mom is like, okay, cool. So we go home. When we get there, he started hitting her. I think that was the first time I've ever seen my dad hit my mom. And how old are you? Is it eight? Yes. And then I remember just screaming and going back to the party calling people. Did the cops get involved ever? Or just okay. It was bad, but I don't really remember how bad it was. Because I have this thing. I will remember that something happened, but I won't remember like vividly what happened. My brain just shuts down those kinds of memories.

SPEAKER_00 13:02

It's just that's very common because this isn't normal, even though it seems normal to some people. You know, those kinds of things. And so a lot of times a coping mechanism is to shut it down. Yeah. You know, put it in a little box and let's leave it to the side. Let's not talk about it. So you know what happened, but you don't know the details. Yes.

SPEAKER_01 13:17

I think the reason why it happened like that also because I loved my dad. I was the teddy school. So I was like, no, it can't be my dad. I was very much in denial. Because I remember the next day when the police came, I was like, I want my dad. Like I was crying for my dad, but my mom is bruised. Like I didn't care about her. I want my dad. Don't take away my dad from me. Yeah. You know? So my mom told me that my brother was older, he was a teenager. He was filled with rage. So my mom sat down with him and she was like, I have to make a decision. I can't do this. I'm tired of the violence. That's the only incident I've ever seen in my life. You know, so I didn't think my dad was on the city. So you think it was just the one time? Yes, I thought it was just the one time. For my other siblings, they don't really tell me what went wrong, but I heard them whisper around, like, oh, I also experienced the same thing. So all experienced the same thing. Nice. But mom says he wants to make a decision. I need to let go of this man. And my brother was convinced that, like, no, I'm still young. Like, she needs him. She can't grow without her father. My brother hated my dad. But for your sake. Yes, for my sake. Yeah. My brother, around those times, started smoking cigarettes, weed. And I was the one that caught him all the time. I was a noisy kid. Like I knew everything that was happening in my house. I was just never vocal about it. I can see you being like that, though. I think I'm still like that.

SPEAKER_00 14:32

Watching, watching.

SPEAKER_01 14:33

Yeah, you know you are, for sure. So now, when I was nine, I remember my brother's age. I think he was 15, 16. He got onto drugs. So my mom decided that with the money that she got, she's gonna stop drinking and renovate the house. She wanted to build like rooms at the back of the house. So in Northwest, we they have a lot, like a big land. So you can do whatever you want. So my mom was like, you know what? I'm gonna build about 10 rooms at the back. So you can rent them out. Yes. So when they're renovating the house, we had to all stay in one room at the back. Because it was finished. All of us, like literally all five of us. That can be all quite in like a small room now. All of you guys are cramped up. No, for sure. So I was sleeping with my brother. So because he got into drugs, he molested me. I don't really remember the memories well, but I only remember these memories because a few years back he touched me. That's when I remembered the memories. And I remember just snipping. Wow. So all like from my primary years, eight to twelve years, I didn't remember. I just remember being uncomfortable with him, but I don't remember what happened. It was only when I was 13 I got triggered and I was like, oh. And then they all came back to you. Yes, they all came back. Wow. During that time when everything happened, I remember just laying there on the bed and he was touching me. And then I remember him wanting to penetrate me and then I pushed him. Like I said, I was a very noisy kid, but I would keep quiet about a lot of things. I kept things to myself. Well, you probably felt like there's things you couldn't talk about. Yes.

SPEAKER_00 15:57

So I kept it to myself. I grew up like a normal child. So, real quick, let me just ask, you said because he got into the drugs. So you point to that. You don't think he would have done that if he hadn't gotten his brain messed up with that? No. With drugs. Was he high and stuff? Would he do the drugs and then be in the house? Yes. Okay.

SPEAKER_01 16:16

But obviously, most of the time I wouldn't know because I was not with him. But then now the year after, my mom started seeing the signs that no man, you're onto something. You know? But she was not sure what it was.

SPEAKER_00 16:30

So she knew something was not right. Yes. And do you mean with you or in regards to the drugs and smoking and that stuff? With the drugs and stuff. Okay. So she never picked up on anything with you?

SPEAKER_01 16:39

As a child, I was a very quiet child. So you could never see if I'm not okay or okay. Because I just sit and just look at people. The only time I'd ever you'd see me shouting and whatever, whatever, I was with boys outside. I liked playing with boys. Yeah. So that's when you'd see like being rough. Yes. Yeah. So that's when you'd see a bit of my personality. I never liked playing with girls. So that's the only time they'll see, oh, she's alive. Like, yeah. No, I get you. I get you. Yeah. And now they decided they're gonna send him to boarding school. I think the boarding school was seven hours away from home. Wow. Might be more. I just don't remember. So I think I was nine when my mom decided to send me to boarding school.

SPEAKER_00 17:15

Because your brother was gonna go alone.

SPEAKER_01 17:17

Yes. You remember I said two houses away? My mom had a best friend, so her child was also my best friend. So she was one year older than me. And she had a brother that was like around the same age as my brother. So they all sent us to boarding school. Together. Yes. But now the problem with going to boarding school with this girl, she's always bullied me my whole life. She was my best friend, but she's always bullied you. Yes. So I was like, oh my gosh, what am I gonna do now? I'm away from my mom. But I remember just being like, oh well, it's life. You know, and then my brother left pudding school three months after. So I was left there. So I attended pudding school for like three years.

SPEAKER_00 17:51

Wow. Yeah. So from grade four or grade five? Grade five. So five, six, and seven? Yes. Before you went to high school? Yes. So talk about that. What was that like? So you're away from your mom, you're away from your dad, you're away from your brother now, even. Yes. But you're with this girl. Yes. Is it like a boys and girls school? Yes.

SPEAKER_01 18:11

So there's hostels, right? The girls live in their own hostel, but there's one dining hall where we can all meet and eat. The girls always get locked up early because it was like a bully school where like it's from primary to high school. So trying to protect. Yes. So it was it was horrible because I was very young, couldn't do a lot of things by myself. So I had to learn, and I also had to grow a thick skin. All my whole life I've been bullied, like from a very young age. But I didn't care because I play around with boys. You know, boys don't take things personal. So I learned to not take anything personal. If someone bullies me, it's like, oh well, who cares? Whatever, yeah. Yeah. But now I live with girls like literally the whole time. I have to learn that girls react like this, girls act like this. You need to fix your hair, you need to wear dresses.

SPEAKER_00 18:57

And then after the situation with your brother, too. So you're already fighting things that you don't even know you're fighting. Yes. Like insecurities, yes, things, you know.

SPEAKER_01 19:06

That's up to you that you don't even realize. Yes. So my eyes were smaller than now. You couldn't see if I opened them or not. So people would like me, just like, oh my gosh, you can't see like during the day. Why do you what do you want to see at night? Are you a rich? You know? So when I got to put in school, I was pretty much cool. Like everybody found me cool. I don't know why, but everybody was just always in my face. Like, this girl is cool, but with a lot of attention, there's a lot of jealousy. So other kids would get jealous, always be on my case. And the girl that was my friend would spread things around, like, why do you find it so cool? Ham her dad beat her mom. You know, stuff like that. She would tell private things. Yes. Okay. So that made me become more reserved, and I kept to myself a lot. Like I didn't cry a lot. I just let things go. Like, okay, cool. So now I was scared of like dating guys. And so obviously I was lonely, so I started dating girls. Okay. Because that felt safer, like I wouldn't get pregnant ever. So I started dating girls. And also I think because I just wanted to feel like my mom is here, you know? Yeah. So when you say that, do you mean like older ones? Yeah, like older, they'll be in high school and I'll be in primary.

SPEAKER_00 20:10

Wow.

SPEAKER_01 20:10

Literally. I'll be in grade five and be dating someone who's in grade nine or ten.

SPEAKER_00 20:15

That's just curious to me. Like, how would this come about? I know in boarding school you do get some of this weird stuff, but how would they go about like they're teenagers and then you're young, and then they would just say, But do you want to be my girlfriend?

SPEAKER_01 20:26

So what would happen is that they had boyfriends out. Okay. Outside the guy, can you? So they would just come up to me, hi, you're so cool. Can you be my girlfriend? So we'll just hold hands, just talk, kiss a bit. That's all we literally did. Wow. Yeah. And then I'd maybe cry to them. That's the only time I ever cried.

SPEAKER_00 20:43

I'd cry to them, I'm going through this, da da da da. They couldn't find me. This is just interesting. And I I've never heard of it described this way, but it makes sense because you were looking for a mom figure. Yes. Or an older sister, let's say. And these girls, for lack of a better word, they were taking advantage, right? Whatever need they're fulfilling. Yes. And so you you have this relationship where it's girlfriends, but it's really just companionship. Like you don't know any other way, but you're just, I guess this is how I'm getting my love and attention and nurturing and care from this older girl. That's a really interesting dynamic. I honestly haven't heard about that.

SPEAKER_01 21:21

So my mom would come maybe after two weeks. She was trying to repair our relationship.

SPEAKER_00 21:26

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 21:26

She would come with a lot of snacks, a lot of food for me. So they would get that. And also, so a lot of my clothes were big, so they just take my clothes. Oh, I get to wear her cool stuff and stuff like that.

SPEAKER_00 21:37

So your mom had money enough. So you were the cool girl in the sense of she had food, she had clothes, she had this. Yes. So they were using you for that stuff. And then you in return were using them for the nurturing and companionship that you wanted.

SPEAKER_01 21:50

Yes. But my mom was very protective of me. In hostels, no mother or parent is allowed to go in.

SPEAKER_00 21:56

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 21:57

So I didn't know. My mom would write my name and my clothes. I didn't know where though, because she'd hide it. So she'd see someone pass with something that's similar to me. She's like, no. But then another person, and then another person is like, no, no, no, no, no. Those are your clothes. And then she'd go back, like, come here, let me see that clothes. And then she would just check at the back, go in the hostel, like literally in and search every girl who's in my room or near my room. And then she'd take my staff and she'd be so mad and she'd take me home for a day, though. And then tomorrow I have to come back because she's not allowed to take me. But my mom was a bit crazy, so she'd pass there. Literally, like, I'm taking my kid, I'm not gonna go back to the city.

SPEAKER_00 22:28

It doesn't matter what you say.

SPEAKER_01 22:29

I don't need a permit to take my kid. So I guess at some point people stopped taking my clothes because they knew I had a crazy mother. So they stopped.

SPEAKER_00 22:38

You said it lasted for those three years. Yeah. Five, six, and seven, right? Yes. Yeah. And did anyone ever try to take advantage of you further during that time? Yes.

SPEAKER_01 22:47

But I was a fighter. If you believed me, I'd just be like, oh well, whatever. But if you touched me, that's where the problem is. I I don't know why, but I've always been this way. Obviously, I didn't know at that time that it's because of the memory for sure it was hidden. Like if someone touched me inappropriately, I was gonna beat you up up to a point where you will be bleeding. My mom always had cases where she had to come to school because bleeding. Yes. Even if you were just bullying me, if I would let you like say whatever you want, who cares? But if you touched me, okay, I was gonna beat you up.

SPEAKER_00 23:17

Obviously, spiritually, you have this anger and all that stuff coming from your background. Yes, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 23:22

And I always thought it came from like my dad being violent and violence at home. So I was just angry because of that, and I had a temper because of that. But I didn't know like the actual problem. Yes, for sure. You know, they never really took advantage of me because they knew if you touch her, she's gonna kill you. Don't try it. Wow, don't attempt. That protected you though, yeah, in that sense, you know. Yeah, also I think I was very religious. So we had a church there. I'd always go to church, but I didn't really know much about God. I just go to church. That's the only time where I get to have peace, you know? And there's no one bullying me, there's no one who expects anything from me.

SPEAKER_00 23:53

So is that what drew you to the church or the chapel or whatever it was? Do you feel like you were searching for something like that? Because you said you felt peace. Did you ever go to church growing up?

unknown 24:03

Yes.

SPEAKER_01 24:04

At home? From a very, very young age, I'd go to church hopping. Like my parents would take us to the church and then they'd leave. I still go. Literally, go alone. Wake up in the morning, ask my mom, what time is it? She tells me that I go to church. My mom would even wake up and prepare me for church because she knew I wanted to go to church. And what did you like about that? What drew you there? Just the fact that I know when I go to church, those three to four hours, there's no one who's bullying me, there's no violence, there's just a preacher preaching. And I'm just sitting at the bag with my thoughts. So you just said peace. Yes, nothing is happening. Wow. So for a very young age, I've always went to church.

SPEAKER_00 24:35

So even at the boarding school, then you felt like this is your time of peace. Yes. But did you ever hear about salvation before? Okay. So you just knew this was a place of peace? Yes. But you didn't know what to do with it. Yes. So Lynn, what happens in high school? Because did you switch schools? You moved to Joburg? What happened? COVID came. So I was forced to like change schools.

SPEAKER_01 24:54

Then I stayed with my parents. Okay. So I can say that's where the problem came. Because in boarding school, you are educated a lot. I started reading in primary. So I read a lot. It was my escape. Like I'd go in my head, you know, read. I just loved reading. So when I was in high school, now in grade eight, I was weird for my parents because I'd wake up in the morning, get food, go to school, come back, close myself in the room, do my schoolwork, read. Yeah. And someone has to remind me, you need to eat, you need to bath. All the time. That was my routine. I was not gonna go out and have dinner with anyone, with my family, whatever. And my family liked having dinner together. So the problem with that was that my family has this tendency of like if something is a painful memory, it's a joke. So during dinner time, everything is a joke. I see. I hated that. So I normally just lock myself in the room. I remember this at the time. I wasn't primary. So my dad and my sister, the one that comes before my brother, they were fighting, and my dad threw a bottle. He was aiming for her head, and then she ducked the bed, and then it just cut her in her face. And it was a joke. I didn't understand why that's supposed to be a joke. So I was like, I'm out. I'll just stay in my room. So my parents found me very, very weird. My mom has pretty good relationships with the kids. She's a good mom. She can be there for you. But with me, she was struggling. Like she was trying to understand what's wrong with her. Because you're different. Yes, like watch mom, speak to me. I wouldn't tell her anything. So this other time we got into like a fight. Actually, let me backtrack. So with staying with them, right? My brother, he was still in tracks, you know? And he would maybe like pass by, slap me out of nowhere. I just let it go, like, whatever. What can I do? Like, I'm not gonna entertain you. Or even are you? So never cared. So in other words, that's the time my parents left us together. I think they went shopping in the morning. So I woke up, I did my schoolwork, and I read and I read and I read. And I was like, oh, actually, I'm hungry. It was like around 12. So I come out of the room, he's busy by the stove. I don't remember who was doing what, but I remember it boiling on the stove. And I think he pushed me. I just turned with it and I threw it in his face. I don't remember what it was even, but I just remember throwing it in the face. That's when I started becoming violent. Ever since that day, he knew when he touched me, I'd fight back. Fighting with knives, I've poured him with water, but it was a lot. And I think because there was a time, I remember him touching me, and I got triggered, and I remembered you did something to me that you were not supposed to do. So ever since that time, if he fights me, I fight back. A lot of things happened that year.

SPEAKER_00 27:20

This was all in 2020.

SPEAKER_01 27:21

Yes. We moved five times. Like it was violence. There was a lot that was happening. You know, that year was just traumatic.

SPEAKER_00 27:28

So that was the year that you point to that because he touched you and it triggered those memories. Yes. And then obviously all the violence that was already happening. Yes. So then that's when you say it shifted, and now you're you're gonna fight back. Yes. And wow.

SPEAKER_01 27:42

Um, I think everything happened in the space of six months. Wow. So my mom, she ended up fighting with me. I don't know what we're fighting about, and we're going back and forth. Now I started to grow a bit of attitude. Like, you know what I'm talking about to do. I mean, you didn't raise me. Who are you? Don't tell me anything. I know how to do everything for myself. So back off. Don't tell me what to do. I'm away, I will do it. And then she got physical with me. So I also fought back. I don't know what was happening in my brain, what made me think I could find my mom, but she beat me up. Like she beat me up.

SPEAKER_00 28:11

What was I thinking? You know? But you weren't. It's just an emotional reaction. You're not thinking, you're just reacting to life.

SPEAKER_01 28:17

And I remember just pushing her, and I admitted that I hate you guys. He molested me, and my dad is violent. Does he even know my birthday? He's never had a conversation with me. He always forgets my name. Wow. So at home, I had a nickname. I'm not gonna say it. So they always call me with that nickname. So because my dad used that nickname a lot, I thought he didn't know my name. Oh, I see. Yes, you know, like some parents like when you they like playing around, like, what's my name? And then they she would always say the nickname. So I assumed he doesn't know my name. Wow. But he didn't pretty much know anything about me, honestly, because he was never at home. Only home once a year. Remember my dad lost his job that my mom came in. But when I was in like grade seven, my dad got a better job. So he would only come home like once. In the year. Yes. So that means in pre school, I would never see him. Okay. She threw all this stuff in your mom's face. What did she say? You're preparing to go somewhere. And then she just looked at me and she was like, What? Remember, these people don't have a relationship with me. They don't know what to trust. So my sister, she always loved me. She was like, You guys have to like do something about it. And I was like, no, this one is a liar. She has the potential to even break our marriage. Why should you believe her? So did your sister know about it then? No, she only found out now. Oh. As I was saying it. So she was just saying, guys, you have to do something about it, you have to do something about it. Because she trusted you immediately. Yes. Nothing was done. Wow. I don't even remember us speaking about it. My dad said, I'm a liar. My mom never said anything. But my mom, since that day, treated me differently. She always wanted a relationship with me. She tried to understand me. Ever since I did, my mom has never laid her hands on me. She'd always tried to understand what's wrong with you. Like you are different from any child I've ever raised. What's different about you? You know? I wrote a lot. So my mom would find my channels, but she would never admit that she found them. She would just read them and just treat me differently. Um in the process of doing that, I met this girl after, so we became best friends. What I would do, because there was a lot of violence at home, I'd go to her house and we'd do sleepovers. My mom didn't have a problem, so I'd sleep there for like a week. Wow. Didn't matter to her mom. So my mom, it was like, why don't you want to be at home? Yeah. Why don't you want to be at home? So there was this other incident. I had a laptop, right? We were fighting for it. And I was like, but it's not yours. But it's like, but you're my sister, my dad is the one that bought it. It's ours. I'm like, no, it's not ours, it's mine. So my brother had like recording memory things. Yeah, flashbacks or something. Yeah, so he had them. So my dad bought him those. If he wants to watch movies, you can just plug them on the TV and just watch movies. You know, leave her alone. What's what's the big deal? We started fighting. There was nice involved. I looked at my mom and I was like, You're gonna do nothing about it. And she was like, What am I gonna do? You guys are always fighting. And I was like, Oh, really? Okay, and I left. I literally hiked cars from where we were staying to where we grew up. Wow. Yeah. What grade eight? It was like three hours away. I was in grade eight. It's the same year. It's the same year. Like, yo, that year a lot of things happened. So I went there and my mom was looking for me. My phone was off. I didn't charge my phone on purpose. I was 13 years old. I remember just being in that house and I was so scared. I was so, so scared. And I was like, what's happening with my life? I don't even know who I am. Like, all I know is just pain. You know, I don't even know who to talk to. But I still didn't cry. Like, I didn't cry about a lot of things. So I was just sleeping there, sleeping there. And the next morning my parents came to fetch me. And my mom was like, to my dad, you always protect your child, my brother. I want him out of my house. He's old now. I'm not gonna lose this child because of him. So I wanna explain the siblings. I have an older sister, she's the firstborn, and then I have a brother, he's the oldest son, okay, from my mom's side. And then I have a sister, the one that we've always stayed with, and then my brother. Yeah. So he decided, my eldest brother, that you know what, she's gonna lose herself. So he was like, you know what, let her come to Joe. Let me take over. So they decided that I'm gonna come this side.

SPEAKER_00 32:08

So after grade eight, all of this stuff's happening. That's when they sent you to your oldest brother.

SPEAKER_01 32:11

Yes.

SPEAKER_00 32:12

On your mom's side. So that way he could take care of you.

SPEAKER_01 32:15

Yes. Okay. So now I was gonna come to grade nine this side. I was 14. My brother was getting married or was engaged to another man. So they decided that I'm gonna stay with my sister. So my sister was staying in a family house. Now there was other kids that we were staying with. I was the oldest girl. So the responsibility fell on me. I had to clean, I had to cook, you know, make sure that they all wrote their homework, stuff like that.

SPEAKER_00 32:41

And you were 14.

SPEAKER_01 32:42

Yes. I remember now I have an attitude. Yeah. You know? And my sister hated it and she forced it out of me. Yo, she would say hateful stuff. Like she never picked me up. She would beat up other kids, but not me. But me, she knew that words can get to me. So she'd use words, she'd manipulate me. Wow. She'd always tell me that your mother doesn't love us, your mother did this to us, your father did this to us, but my brother was the one that was supporting me financially. And she would just demand a lot of money for no reason. And she demands the money from my brother and my parents. I knew everything, but like I said, I was a child that kept things to herself. Imagine with everything happening. So obviously, I'm the oldest girl. I knew that, like, obviously, the house has to be clean, I have to wash laundry. So I would take the other responsibilities for others. Like I'd be like, it's just unfair. So let me just do it. My brother started noticing, like, no, man, something is wrong with your grades. It's not like you. No matter what's happening, your grades are always high. Like, what's wrong? I was like, nothing, you know, maybe it's just a new environment. I'm not used to this side. But my brother was like, no, something is wrong. So my mom told him, When something's wrong, she doesn't say anything, but something's wrong. Eventually, I ended up just telling my mom that, like, I can't do this anymore. I don't even have time to like do my homework. I have to do everything. My sister keeps telling me, like, she's the queen of the house, you must all be her maids. And because I had a bit of an attitude, I just felt like maybe the way she's treating me is right. Like she's just disciplining me. But I was realizing that no, man, this is not discipline now. She's just abuse. Yeah. And she was very manipulative. Hey, so her daughter is the same age as me.

SPEAKER_00 34:11

Whoa, whoa, whoa, okay. So your niece is the same age as you. Yes. Obviously, because you we know your parents are older, they had a hundred kids. So your niece is the same age as you. Your sister had two kids, so she had a small child.

SPEAKER_01 34:23

Yes, she was nine, ten. She was the princess of the house. You know, others would get mistreated. And literally, I remember this other time my sister said to me, She has school. I'll be like, I also have school. Then she'll be like, You're back chatting. I always knew that's why your parents decided to move you around. They don't love you because you have an attitude, da da da da, stuff like that. When the year was over, okay, now I'm about to leave. Then I can just be honest, like, oh, that's why my grades were sleeping. And I told them, My brother was furious. He was like, I'm taking you back. I've been spending so much money on her, she's been lying to us.

SPEAKER_00 34:56

Wow.

SPEAKER_01 34:56

And then he took me in. So grade 10, I stay with him. It was nice. We kept out of each other's business. So me and my brother very similar. He managed his business, I minded mine. He doesn't speak about his feelings. I don't speak about mine. So we were very similar in that. And the home environment was okay. It was totally fine. Like we were okay. Wow. But the guy was a sangoma. So from a very young age, even when my mom was a sangoma, I never believed in these things. They would try to like make me wash with things. I even have some scars because they forcefully want to cut me. I don't know why I resisted. It would frustrate my dad because I always said no. But you didn't know why, you just didn't like it. I was like, you don't do that to me. At the time, I think I thought that my brother was on drugs because of witchcraft. I was like, it's because you guys keep on bringing it back home. If you guys wouldn't do all of these things, then maybe witchcraft wouldn't exist enough.

SPEAKER_00 35:42

So you were blaming witchcraft for those things that you knew where the witchcraft came from.

SPEAKER_01 35:45

So I was like, no, I'm not doing that. I'm not gonna track that in my life. I was like, that's why you guys are so miserable. It's because of witchcraft. And you guys also perform it. Because why are you cutting yourself? And why are you doing it at night? That's witchcraft. So I'd always refuse. When they wake up, I'm sleeping. I'm not doing that. So obviously, when I'm sleeping, they cut me, they do all of those stuff. So he was a sangoma. It was a church that I was going to. This is your brother's husband. He's a sangoma. He's a sangoma. Okay. So where we were staying, we're staying in Indonesia. So where we were staying, there was a Christian church. So I'd go there like all the time, like every Sunday. And he had a problem with it. It would make remarks, but I didn't get. Yeah. So now, I'm in high school, obviously now I get introduced to like boys, weed, but I was not there yet. I was just like, I had a lot of friends, you know? Not a lot, but just I had cool friends. Yeah. You just like chill all the time. Yes. Now I experience violence again. They had a house and they had a main house, and then there was a bedroom that I was staying in. So I hear like commotions. So I don't sleep at night. I even still struggle with this. I read at night. That's when I'm more focused. I will read like no one's business. It's your peace time. Yes, I will read like no one's business. So I would be reading, and then there's bickering in the house. Now I hear glasses breaking. He comes. Open this door, my brother's husband. Open this door, open this door. He'd take my stuff, throw them out of the yard. He'd take my stuff and throw them out of the yard, but leave my brother's stuff in. So he was mad at your brother, but he would take it out of you. It's like, what is that even? Oh, gone. I told you I don't want to stay with this girl. Then that's how I would find out that, oh, he didn't agree for me to stay with you guys. So they would fight. I'll just go stand outside and watch. I'm used to it. I faced violence at home. Yeah. So like I'm not gonna entertain you. So I just sit down beepy with my phone. But I remember the first time I panicked. My dad has never ever laid hit. Not even just as a child, like, stop doing that. Never. So obviously, I understand that people are violent, but they don't hit you. But with my brother, because it's my brother and we like the age difference is not that much. I thought we would just fight. So with him, I didn't understand like to what extent is the violence.

SPEAKER_00 37:46

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 37:46

I panicked and I called the police when I sat there and I watched until they were done. So they fought each other? Yes.

SPEAKER_00 37:53

Wow.

SPEAKER_01 37:54

I faced this before, so I'll just watch. When you guys are done, you can tell me what's the way forward. I was just like crying, crying. And then my brother, when they were done, they took our stuff. So my brother had like friends in the area, they just took our stuff, took us in, slept. In the morning, we're going to school by the way, get ready for school, go to school, normal, come back. We are moving out. Okay, cool. We just move in for like two weeks, three weeks, we're back again. Okay, cool. The violence happens again. Okay, we're moving out. Okay.

SPEAKER_00 38:18

But now it's just the same cycle of abusive relationships, but now it's your brother and his husband instead of your parents or instead of whatever. Okay.

SPEAKER_01 38:25

And I was like, tell me something new. Yeah. But now, obviously, I had a panic attack. I'm starting to get anxiety, depression. I started self-harming. You know, I didn't know how to deal with the pain anymore. The self-harming didn't come in until I dream about him, my brother's husband. And my mom was like, No, that's on, that's witchcraft. Remember, I didn't believe in these things, I didn't know what's witchcraft, what's not. But I didn't care because also I didn't believe in dreams as well. Like I was like, whatever. And then at night. So I had to train someone as well, right? Yeah. So now the person would sleep with me because remember, I was sleeping in the back room. So the lady was sleeping with me, and then at night she would hear me say, Hal once, and I shut down and I was not breathing. They would check my pulse, I was not breathing, there was nothing. And then my brother would come and wake me and wake me and then I'd wake up again. Whoa. That would happen a lot of times. I never tell people this story, but I remember when I was telling a lot of people that was just like, That's not true. So I never saw that.

SPEAKER_00 39:18

No, but that's crazy. Yeah, but can I tell you? I've lived here long enough and I've lived around places long enough to know that witchcraft has no bounds. Yeah. And when you're talking about physical things that don't seem possible, when you talk about them spiritually, absolutely. Anything can happen because we live in a very spiritual world and your whole family's opened you up, your whole family's involved in all this stuff. So really anything is possible. Yes. I've heard stories and anything is possible. So I'm not disinclined to believe you at all.

SPEAKER_01 39:46

So that's when the self-harming came in, because that's the only time I've ever felt like in control of myself because I didn't understand. When they wake me up, I just wake up and cry. What happened? Like what just happened? Because everybody now is in my face, and I just woke up. But when I wake up, there's just this feeling of fear. Yeah. Like I'm scared. Like, what just happened to me? And it happened over and over again. That's when so I mean, like, we it was bad. How old were you by this age? Um, I was 15. Okay. I was 15 years. So it happened for like about two years because we're staying with him, moving in, come back. Did anyone ever confront you about your self-harm? Did anyone ever know? So I don't know how my mom found out. I think one day I she called me and I broke down and I told her.

SPEAKER_00 40:28

Wow.

SPEAKER_01 40:28

Obviously, you should call my brother. And then this other time I was cleaning and I had my sleeves up. Because now someone brought it to his attention. He he noticed that, what the heck? You are self-harming dad. So when he found out I had to stop self-harming, obviously, on my hand. So I'd do it on my thigh. And then the razor's not working anymore, and then I started binding myself. Burning yourself? Yeah. On my thigh. I had lighters. And my brother would buy me lighters, but he didn't know why. I'd only tell him, Oh, the reason why I use lighters is because I'm trying to distinct myself from self-harming. So I'd play with the lighter. He'd see me play with it. So he thought, like, I'm just playing with it. And he'd buy me a lot, like I had cool lighters. He thought it was like a fidget thing. Yeah, because I'd always bounce my leg. So when I played with it, I stopped bouncing my leg. So it gave him like reassurance that I'm okay. But you were self-harm with the lighters. Yes. So my brother was working in the school that I was at. So he made me attend counselling. You know what I would do? I'd literally tell them what they want to hear. I mean, like, I'm doing so good. Yesterday I wanted to self-harm, but I did not. I'd tell them, like, I'm dealing with this and this and this, but not like tell them, oh, this is how I feel about it. I'd be like, oh, I'm dealing with this and this. Like, don't worry. I didn't self-harm. A journal in my channel, hear what you want to hear. Just for my brother. For him, I knew that I was still self-harming. He didn't know that I was doing it on my thai. And then finally, he decided that they want to get a divorce, him and the guy. The last incident was pretty bad. I think there was blood involved. We moved out. And I didn't know that he made a lot of bad financial decisions because yo, it knocked us off track. Like yo, it was bad. But you know, my parents stepped in.

SPEAKER_00 41:54

He got divorced, and then did you move both back in with your parents?

SPEAKER_01 41:58

No. Okay. We moved here in Fedon Park. Okay. So now, while we were staying in Freedom Park, my brother started drinking like a lot. But they never officially got divorced. They just celebrated. This other time, I was 16 now. My brother was drinking. I don't know what cut to him, and he brought a guy over in like a small room, you know. And he never did those kind of stuff. Like I said, I don't sleep at night. So it was like 2:30 o'clock. That's the time that I went to bed. So 15 minutes in my sleep, I can feel someone is in my face. Remember, I was staying in the back room. I stayed in boarding school. So I was very protective of myself. So when I woke up, I didn't wake up like I'm seeing you, you know. I tapped like what's besides me. I wanted to feel my brother. My brother's not there. But I feel a knife. So I grab it and I wake up and I pointed at him. And it's a random guy. I'm looking at my brother. He's sleeping on the couch. And I look at him, I'm like, what are you doing? And then I took my phone and then I took another knife that was in the cupboard and I ran in the main house and I screamed. And they all went outside. Apparently, when I went this way, he went the other way. And he took my brother's phone. Wow. I don't know what he was trying to do. But you woke up with a knife. But I woke up with the knife. Yo, that whole incident really, really affected me. I could not sleep at night. I did not trust my brother anymore. I just felt like when he was out at night, I have to stay up at night until he comes back so that I can sleep and lock us inside the house. Yeah. I didn't tell my mom. I just kept it to myself. A lot of things I kept them to myself. So let me backtrack. So when I was in grade 10, the school that I went to was in Eldos School. Willow Crescent. Okay. So Boosie and Nandi witnessed to me this other Saturday when I was 15. And that whole year I didn't come to church because I was staying in Indonesia.

SPEAKER_00 43:38

So I just had a flyer. I've had Boosie and Nandi both on this podcast give their testimony. So it's just it's cool that you pointed to them. It was just like on a Saturday. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 43:46

Okay. I was just like an outreach on a Saturday. They witnessed to me, they prayed with me, sinister. I was with a friend. And then that was just that. But now grade 11, that whole incident happened with the guy with the knife, and I started drinking pills. Like I would want to drink pills to overdose, but I'd Up dizzy, something different with my body. I started realizing I'll do that a lot. So that I was smoking weed, but I stopped because now I was in grade 11. I wanted to focus, and it was also affecting my eyes. So I'm drinking these pills, wanted to overdose. But then I started feeling this feeling, man, like high. Like, oh, okay, I'm a bit high. Escape. Yeah. I tried to do that. You know what they were? No. Mix like where did you find them? In the house. My brother has a cabinet of like different kinds of laws, like medicine. You had no idea what they were. Yeah. You just take them. I just take them. So I remember this other time I drank a lot of them and I called my dad. I don't have a relationship with my dad, but I called my dad that day. I was like, I just miss you. I miss you so much. And then the airtime cut and I cut myself and I sat in like a bathep full of water. And I was like, I wanna die. And I remember bleeding a lot that day. But I woke up, I did not understand. That was the first time I was like, God, I don't understand why. What are you trying? Like, what are you saying to me? Is this a joke? Like, I don't want to be here anymore. I don't want to be alive. Like, I'm tired. And I remember it's August because I have a picture of myself in church. And I said to a friend of mine, she attended church with Carol and them. Okay. And I said to her, Do you still go to that church? She was like, Yeah, I do. And I was like, let's just go. So what I would do and come in only Sunday morning and sit by those chairs, you know, they're the back. Yeah. Come in like one minute before the service starts and then leave immediately after the service ends. And I remember just watching your husband and be like, what does this guy think? We're in America? Like, what are you saying? Like, literally, I just look at him like, what is he saying? What does he know? He's from America. Life is nice there, you know. I'd always do that. Like I did that for like August until December. And then I visited home. And then I came back when I was doing my trick. That's when I faithfully came to church now. Like it clicked. I got saved.

SPEAKER_00 45:42

Let's talk about that. So all this stuff is happening. Yeah. You've tried to commit suicide a couple times. When you were in the bathtub, no one found you. You just woke up.

SPEAKER_01 45:50

I just woke up with like a loss of blood. A lot of it. Did you even go to the doctor? My brother took me to the doctor because he got home and he saw that I was weak. He was like, What's wrong with you? And then he just took me to the doctor and they were like, You are fine. You just need to eat, drink a lot of water. You lost a lot of blood.

SPEAKER_00 46:05

So you didn't tell them? They just said that you were like on your cycle or something. Wow. And back home. Like I said, I kept a lot of things to myself. Yeah. So then when you came in, you just came in for a few months, then you went home for December. Come back in Jan.

SPEAKER_01 46:18

Let me tell you what actually made me want to get saved. Juline get saved. I could always answer the article, but it didn't click what's salvation. So that December, that friend, she was dealing with also witchcraft things. They said she has to be a sang command. So at night when we were sleeping, she'd scream and I'd pray. I remember just, I don't know what I was saying, but I was praying and she'd be fine. And I was like, wow. So God is real. I think He can also do that for me. He can heal me. I can get healed. He can heal my broken family. The violence was still going on. But God is real. Like I prayed for this girl and she's fine. Like, you know. That's crazy that you saw that yourself. Yes. You know? I don't even remember what I was saying. I just remember just praying for her. And then January, when I was doing my trick, I got like literally from there. I remember just asking my husband, I want to join ministry.

SPEAKER_00 47:05

So there's not really like a one moment, but you cried out to God and you saw God fixed the situation. Yes. Then that's what was like, wow, this is real. Yes.

SPEAKER_01 47:14

I think that's when it clicked what salvation is. I didn't even think much of it. But when that happened, it was like, oh, so salvation means that you get saved. You know, you have your own personal relationship with God. God helps you with a lot of things. He heals you. And then, but now when I came to church, my brother just started becoming violent. And I remember just come back from church and it would just bang me with a bagler and or just what? Like a backlash. What do you guys call it? I don't know what's put like a like a security door. You see here by the church, this sliding thing. Oh, okay. Okay, okay, okay. Yes. Like a slime gate. Yes, but that one it's like a door, you open it. Yes.

SPEAKER_00 47:50

We call them storm doors or we call them security doors. Yeah. Okay. Yeah. So he hid me with it. Go back where you're coming from. So he was pretty much fine with you with all the other stuff. But as soon as you started coming to church and changing, then he's angry now. Now he wants to be violent with you personally.

SPEAKER_01 48:05

I was also like a child that never went anywhere. I was not going out. So it was a bit of a problem for him. Like, what's with this church, you know? And then I don't remember who advised me, but I remember someone advising me like you need to speak to your pastors. And then I went to Pastor Leben and just told him that, like, I'm going through this and this and that. I was like, that is not acceptable. You can't keep on living like that. This other time. People don't actually know the story, like what happened. So my brother, like I said, financially he was struggling now. Plus, also the drinking.

SPEAKER_00 48:32

He was And this is the whole year of my trick, right? Yes. That's going on.

SPEAKER_01 48:35

So now this other friend of mine, her mom, has like a little shock. My brother was like, Can you please go ask her to borrow us money? Okay, cool. How much do you need? So at that time, I was selling perfumes. So financially, we were not struggling to a point where now we were not eating. But he always was struggling with money. So my parents came in. So now he's like, I must go borrow that money. I'm like, okay, cool. I have some money in my bank, I can give it to you. He's like, no, just go borrow that money. When I went there, that lady was like, Can you please go with throw it at the bank and then just go take it to your brother? So I came late and he started throwing me with bottles and just hitting me. And I had an exam Monday. And I was like, Pastor Demon said this is unacceptable. What do I do? And I remember that Sunday morning, I just went to go with all my money. And then I gave it to him because I saved up a lot. So I was like, you know what? Just have my money. I'm out. And I just got up and I dressed up for church. I was just tired. And I spoke to Pastor, I am so tired. I can't do this anymore. Like I can't. And obviously, Pastor Levin decided to take me in.

SPEAKER_00 49:38

Yeah. Because I think once you realize it's not normal, once you get to a place where this whole year you've been seeing God change you, you've been seeing this, then you start to realize that is not normal. That's not okay. Like you said that it was when Pastor Leibin said this is not acceptable. Then you realize it's not. Why have I been letting it be okay and normalize behavior that's not normal? Yes. That's when it becomes exhausting. Now you're seeing it for what it is, and you're like, whoa, this is not okay. This is not normal. I know salvation is a journey, right? But in this whole time going from 11th grade to 12th grade and in this transition time where you really feel like you get it. What was the biggest thing that made you feel at peace with the decision? Like, what was it that God did in you that you realized this is serious and for life? Like I want to be here, I want to stay. Describe like that kind of revelation where you no longer wanted to self-harm, but the shift.

SPEAKER_01 50:37

So for me, it was on a 180 concert, and I think Uncle Snati and them were performing, and their lyrics are very relatable. So I just felt like I can stop, like I can stop self-harming. That was the day that I felt like, you know what, I'm done. Like if these people can stand on stage and speak about how you can stop. There's this song, there's this girl that was like suicidal. I'm not really sure, but I think that's what touched me as well. Wow. And I was like, oh, because I always believed that I was a weird kid. There was something wrong with me, but I realized that there's nothing wrong with me. I'm just broken.

SPEAKER_00 51:10

So that's really powerful. I think they really enjoy hearing that. Yeah. That what they wrote about actually changes lives because it gave you the hope that you needed. Yes. Wow, that's amazing. Yeah. That's really amazing, actually. So, what would you say to a young girl listening? What would you say from your life experiences to keep them going? Or if you could talk to your past self or someone that's going through the same thing, what would you tell them?

SPEAKER_01 51:36

I I just say to them that like a lot of things don't have to make sense. Like a lot of decisions that you make. For example, Pastor Levin was guiding me, was not making them. Yeah. So deciding that even if my brother's gonna be violent, I'm still gonna come to church. Even if I have to move out at an early age, like a lot of things don't make sense. They don't have to. But I know definitely God will come through. Any decision that you make regarding salvation doesn't have to make sense to me or to that girl or to whoever, it doesn't have to make sense. Just obey God, He will help you. I was very young. I moved out when I was 17, so it didn't make sense, but till today, God is still moving in my life. Yeah, He's still moving, so nothing has to make sense to you in that moment. Just keep on believing God will help you. He will.

SPEAKER_00 52:23

I love that perspective. We do try to figure everything out and we want it to make sense. Yeah. But I love that you said it doesn't have to make sense to me. It doesn't make sense, but I'm gonna trust that what my pastors, what my headship, what this older saint is telling me because of their life, then you see in time, God still has come through and God still makes good on his promises.

SPEAKER_01 52:46

Yeah, even with my brother when I had to move out and stuff, I was like, I'm used to the violence. Why do I want to move out now? It was not making sense to me, but now it is.

SPEAKER_00 52:55

The devil we know, we think is safer than the devil we don't know, right? So I'm comfortable in the violence because I know it, but I don't know what's out there in this new situation. And then culture tells you one thing, and this other stuff doesn't make sense, but it but it's okay. It doesn't have to. God is still gonna work it out. Wow, that's really special. I really like that a lot. Thank you. Thank you so much for taking the time and telling me your story was full of surprises. I like I know you, like you said, over and over. You don't talk about a lot of stuff. Yeah, so I know that in those times you did come and talk to me, and I know we had some serious conversations, and I remember telling you, like, don't give up, don't give up. It's gonna be okay. You know, I remember standing in the back prayer room and you're just so upset and crying, and I was like, it's okay, don't give up, just keep going, keep doing the right thing. And now here we are, two years later, and wow, yeah, you're on the edge of a brand new chapter, a wedding coming up in May. And that's really cool. Just see what God's done in your life. Thank you. I really appreciate it.

SPEAKER_01 53:57

Thank you so much for having me. Some of the things I even forgot about them. But this really made me reflect on what God has done in my life.

SPEAKER_00 54:04

Absolutely. Yeah, absolutely. That's why I love doing this. It makes all of us realize God really has changed. Yeah, he did so much in my life inside my heart as well. Yeah, I can even speak about it without crying anymore. That's a big deal because I know a lot of those things, man, are very emotional, and looking at you, you would never say that all those things were there. Like the violence and the anger and all the craziness. Because you really are such a beautiful person. Watching you with people, you're always smiling and you're funny, and you're not that person anymore. And that to me is why I love doing this, because I get to see who you are, and then I learn about who you were, and I'm like, how is that even the same person? Yeah. Because of God. God is so faithful. That's awesome. So I want to take this time to say thank you to my listeners. Without a listener, the story can't be heard. If you would like to contact me with questions, comments, or ideas, you can do so through the podcast email, not the same.cfm at gmail.com. Take a moment to rate and review on whichever platform you're using. Like, subscribe, follow, and most of all, share. Last but not least, I encourage you to take a moment and examine yourself. If you're not a Christian or perhaps don't know, you can be. The Bible tells us that out of pure love, God sent his only son to die for our sin. A simple prayer is all it takes to acknowledge your sin, to recognize Jesus paid for that sin on the cross, and to sincerely ask for forgiveness. Until next time, this is Rachel Heinberg, and you've been listening to Not the Same.